Another theorem of mine: When you post/tweet something positive and people like it, after 5-20 hours the dark side of the force enters. With ad hominem, whataboutism and plain trolling. Typically by accounts you never interacted with. 1/3

They are fly-by poop emojis. They unload their stinking pile of negativity and never interact beyond that. They are not interested in exchanging arguments, they only hope to cover the positivity with their stinking shit. 2/3

You can ignore it (and you should) but they are the guardians of the negativity that fuels “social” networks. No matter how uplifting your story was, people that discover it after that 20 hours will be left confused and think you’re not really a good example. 3/3

Example. What I said and what I got after a few hours. Not the first time this happens to me. I understand how it drives people away freedom m posting the positive things we all need. The dark side is winning.

Follow

Disclaimer: this happened on Twitter, not here on the Mastodon network.

Just follow the various replies to the parent toot to see my theorem in action.

@jwildeboer "the mastodon network"

fedi doesnt just consist of people who use elephant software
@jwildeboer anyway sexism is defined as doing things because of someone's sex. sounded like you asked to switch roles simply because she was a woman. you wouldnt have done anything if it was a man
@jwildeboer im not a guy but i still dont think feminism is the way to go because it only serves to perpetuate the things feminists claim to be against. if youre really focused on treating women the same as men, by what they do rather than who they are, then you wouldnt draw any attention to the fact that someone has a vagina

@wowaname thank you for using your whataboutism to EXACTLY make my point. Le sigh.

@jwildeboer thank you for treating every counter-argument you receive as if its a bad-faith one
@jwildeboer so, tell me where im wrong instead of naming fallacies off the top of your head. that shit may work on reddit but it doesnt work with me

@wowaname never on any of my posts on this I claimed I’m a hero of feminism. I gave up my seat on stage to point out that I, as a man, felt uncomfortable that it was only men on stage.

@jwildeboer and why should you go out of your way to feel uncomfortable? i think most normal people would not try to see how many cis white heterosexual men were in a group and how it was lacking strong independent black women
@jwildeboer i seek out after actual injustices, like women not having voting opportunity in their countries, or women not having the same personal freedoms as men, or people getting sent to jail due to things out of their control
@jwildeboer i think you receive negative feedback all the time because your ideologies just dont hold up, thats all

@wowaname I receive positive feedback too. More than the negative ones, TBH.

@jwildeboer while i do follow you, i think i havent seen you post enough to get a better picture of who you are, so i will refrain from judging you based off things i dont know

but, take this how you will: we generally tend to surround ourselves with people who agree with us
@wowaname @jwildeboer it's only notable if that group is making decisions that affect people not in that group ie. only men decide things about women's rights or reproductive rights. if a group isn't making any influence on any other groups it's a nonissue as far as I'm concerned
@moonshine @jwildeboer yeah that makes sense. to my knowledge an AI panel isnt very sex-sensitive
@wowaname @jwildeboer yeah unless we're discussing ai voice on helpers or whatever it's a very small specific part lol
@moonshine @jwildeboer just use those monotone robot voices like in the movies, problem solved

@wowaname you are too early :) I postulated 5 hours before the negativity kicks in. How many protocols/standards are included in the ? What is wrong when I limit my statement to the network I interact with?

@jwildeboer theres the activitypub standard, which mastodon doesnt follow. eugen has always opted to do his own thing with the network and cause headache for people (pleroma, honk, and whatever else that uses AP) who actually want to implement AP correctly and follow standards, allowing for full interop between AP implementations

>What is wrong when I limit my statement to the network I interact with?

simple, youre interacting with me. i dont use mastodon

>I postulated 5 hours before the negativity kicks in.

i suggest not ostracising other users of the fediverse with your poor word choice
@jwildeboer @wowaname Mastodon Pleroma PeerTube Pixelfed Plume Honk Microblog.pub and so many more (see fediverse.network)
@mewmew @jwildeboer @wowaname He asked about protocols/standards though ^^;
Right now it is only AP but there used to be OStatus. Mastodon is not a protocol.

@Mikoto @wowaname @mewmew and FTR - I much more enjoy discussions here than over on twitter. At least people here reply. And yes, I’m Dutch. So I might come over as rude when it’s just me being direct. I’m working on myself. Since years. I’m just more and more unsure if “social” networks are helpful or not in that.

@jwildeboer @Mikoto @mewmew social networks and the idea of global connectivity is still very new in our society, so it's easy to end up using social networks unconstructively. we just arent used to it, we all disagree on what should be the norm of behaviour here, et cetera
@jwildeboer @Mikoto @wowaname I agree with ya - I often get more negative interaction here, but I've never been online when no one's around to talk, it's a much more close community than Twitter which is what I like about it
@mewmew @jwildeboer @Mikoto the fact that over here you can talk in more than 140 or 280 characters means responses tend to be more valuable than on twitter

that said @jwildeboer fix your mastodon the 500 characters is too small :cryAqua:
@jwildeboer acting like a smartass doesnt land you many friends :)

@wowaname were you there in 2017 when this happened? Am I a smart add for telling my side of the story? I honestly don’t understand why the default reaction on social networks is negativity. Maybe I should just stop being here. It drags me down, even when I post a story I deem to be positive.

@jwildeboer im not even talking about 2017 dude chill out, im talking about how you respond to and subpost people who dare disagree with you on anything lol

@wowaname how can we have a positive discussion? Honest question. That’s what drives me. I want to have positivity.

@jwildeboer here's the real answer even though it isnt a feasible one: dont have opinions. thats it.

there are always going to be two or more sides to everything. im simply stating my side, and since you already were kinda shitty about your side ("why are people giving me a hard time for doing something that nobody even asked me to do") i decided to poke a bit of fun in my response. take the internet less seriously and youll have a better time. i was not trying to be any less genuine with my response even though i decided to shitpost a bit at your expense
@jwildeboer i'd be really surprised if anyone at that event you attended even realised that it was an all-male panel, let alone cared. thats my point

@wowaname exactly. They didn’t. Until I said it and offered my seat. Yes. I like to provoke. The organiser was pissed. The audience applauded.

@jwildeboer i like to provoke as well which is maybe why you saw my responses as negativity :backfromgab:

@wowaname yes. And I apologise. It’s just that negativity has become the default too many times. Hrmpf.

@jwildeboer it gets to me sometimes too, there are some groups that you just want to avoid as quickly as possible rather than having them wear you down. and even then your "normal" interactions can get you on a bad day, in which case its probably best to take a break. ive had to close out of fedi for a day or two on numerous occasions because sometimes i just know it isnt the type of interaction thats gonna make me feel better

@wowaname unfortunately I’m quite a public account, being an official spokesperson for Red Hat. I totally love the freedom they give me, but it also means I have to be diligent and must react.

@jwildeboer oh that explains the red hat in your picture :v

can you tell them to get rid of gnome and poettering and everything that's been turning enterprise linux into a pile of shit
@jwildeboer anything backed by competent developers. i keep hearing gnome ripping out usability and accessibility features, systemd making awful design and code decisions, mozilla just getting worse after every passing year. not to mention that most of this stuff is horribly complex and requires people to pretty much read the entire codebases in order to understand how to set up this shit from scratch. it's very unfriendly to end users and it seems like package maintainers and upstream devs are the only ones who are expected to hack on any of it

to me that goes against the idea of free software

@wowaname thank you for describing problems. Now hand me solutions. That work in the real world. Telling me that Red Hat is all wrong isn’t helpful. How can we do better?

@jwildeboer i assume by "work in the real world" you imply that it should be web-friendly as well, to an extent. and if thats the case, i cant help you much in that front because im very anti-web. i have a long-term goal to completely get rid of a modern web browser and switch entirely to native software to do stuff (like a desktop fediverse client, desktop matrix client, etc). i already stopped using webmail and other stuff due to the goal i set for myself

i just dont think web is sustainable for full-fledged applications. we already see web developers reaching their limits with http/1.x and http/2 and trying to expand to a UDP reimplementation of the protocol, we already see stuff like websockets and webrtc to circumvent limitations of plain http, etc

the "real world" of tech needs to be fixed as far as im concerned, before we can worry about adapting our software to the real world
@jwildeboer transiently it's been worsening major linux distributions as well

i had to finally Install Gentoo because i was getting tired of everything else
gentoo.png

@wowaname you didn’t answer my question ;) do you want KDE instead? Enlightenment? SysV style init? No cgroups? No containers? Should we switch to Devuan as upstream?

@jwildeboer i didnt give a real answer because there isnt really one clear-cut solution. but yes, i'd prefer kde over gnome (i also like xfce due to its low footprint)

theres multiple sysv replacements out now, like openrc-init (which supports cgroups), daemontools-style stuff like runit. plenty of choice already and they each have their strengths

@wowaname yet our users and customers seem to be quite happy with our decisions and happily pay for their subscriptions, allowing us to employ more than 14k people. Isn’t that worth something?

@jwildeboer im assuming most of your customers are businesses. being better than microsoft is kind of easy
@jwildeboer even for non-business use, being better than microsoft is easy. the only things holding people back from using linux these days are: specialised multimedia software and new video games
Show more
Show more

@wowaname anyone out there is always free to compete. Be the next Red Hat! Show us we are wrong. By winning in the market. I for one am proud to work for an organisation that makes every piece of software and still is able to pay all employees every month :)

@jwildeboer The good thing about the Fediverse is that it's easy to ignore whole instances, and I had that one silenced already.

It's the assholes who thrive on negativity, and they usually come in groups of like-minded people.

@galaxis @jwildeboer I have no idea how to ignore whole instances as a Mastodon user, is this even possible? Fortunately so far I only had to block a handful of spammers, so I don't have an urgent need.

On negativity, I think that the anonymity plays a big role. There is not a lot social about "social media". Only few people would be as rude in face to face conversations as they are when they can hide on the web.

@schaueho @galaxis yes. That’s my fundamental rule. Whatever I post as reply is something I would say to that person when they’re sitting next to me and I look them into their eye.

@schaueho Right - as a user, you can only block instances. Which has the downside of removing all of your existing relations. But then, in my time on here, there's been about two instances that I would have liked to block in entirety, but didn't because I wanted to keep following one or two persons on there.

In general, I still think that anonymity is an enabler, and I have seen little evidence that its removal makes for better online experiences (see Facebook).

@jwildeboer

Sign in to participate in the conversation
social.wildeboer.net

Mastodon instance for people with Wildeboer as their last name