In my brain the rewiring is complete. Centralised services like focus on (artificially boosted) reach. Decentralised services like reward sharing instead. If you look at it that way, a lot of things make more sense, IMHO :)

A bit more explanation. Over on Twitter many (subconsciously) try to feed The Algorithm and not their followers. the Algorithm seemingly rewards extreme takes better than real communication. As we currently don’t really have such an algorithm here, we (again subconsciously) crater more towards our followers. Extreme takes here are typically (exceptions exist, hello ;) not rewarded but more often lead to less interaction. This is something the new users here, coming from Twitter, 1/2

Have to learn. Or not. When they don’t do, they turn away disappointed, telling others that mastodon is weird, empty and simply not rewarding. But when they do understand, they have to unlearn a lot. 2/2

This learn/unlearn process is what I referred to when I said my rewiring is complete. HTH.

@onepict no business model focused on reach, is my current thought. Business happens on a different level here and definitely isn’t the main motivation. Maybe we will see instances switching to an ad based model, who knows. Or users understanding that a cheap subscription is the best way to make sure „their“ instance stays the way it is. I don’t know yet.

@onepict @jwildeboer Yes! It seems that here (now), sharing content that is actually useful / interesting for the broad audience in the fediverse is rewarded, because when that gets boosted, you will gain more reach organically. There is no algorithm in the fediverse that converts money into reach (yet), so until that happens, you build it with a combination of built up credibility and a well-crafted post with actual interesting content. I say yet, because it might pop up somewhere?

@jwildeboer They also reward being yourself, instead of an influencer or what the algorithm encourages you to be.

@kiview @pete Dopamine level of he users instead of ka-ching for the operators ;) No, but seriously. I think the mastodon experience, one you look at it the way I described, makes more sense and becomes more personal and direct. Likes and follower count don’t (yet) define everything.

@jwildeboer @pete The initial mechanism for triggering the dopamine rush seems the same though (excitement about notification, with very similar UI).

@jwildeboer @pete lol I just realized clicking "favourite" in Mastodon is a lot of run, because of the star animation :D

@kiview @jwildeboer Despite the fact both platforms have notifications, I still believe the real dopamine of Twitter comes from the engagement. The algorithm shows what’s most divisive, most trending, most click-baity, and most relevant. Yes, people like acknowledgement others enjoy their content, but at the end of the day it’s the timeline they’re endlessly scrolling and addicted to.

@pete @jwildeboer Good point, I did not consider the engagement effect of the timeline itself.

@jwildeboer this is one of the things Jon Philips mentioned often... You might remember him, he was one of the guys working for Creative Commons and with Evan Prodromou at StatusNet/Identica.

@jwildeboer I must say I still have the instinctual urge to check for notifications, still got the attention seeking part of me for now, I hope that being more active here will help the rewiring.

@vikingcson @jwildeboer And the UI using the same pattern for creating excitement (and thereby dopamine boost) for new notifications does not help I'd say.

@jwildeboer Agree, and in addition to the Twitter Algorithm rewarding for extremes it also seems to reward for the extremely banal such as the pointless 2-choice question "Do you prefer eggs scrambled or fried?" or "Would you rather have a duck sitting on your foot or a cat sitting on your lap?" or wheels vs doors, etc etc etc ad nauseum. Those questions can get a lot of responses on Twitter, mainly cos ppl feel it's something they can reply to. But I feel (happily) that those sorts of pointless questions wouldn't go down so well over here cos ppl are looking to have a bit more thought and genuine interactions with ppl (not just feeding The Algorithm).

@vera @jwildeboer
idk from my experience, banal memes get a lot of traction here as well. Things like getting #kawen twending again. Unfortuantely also things like "pleroma is nazi software".

I've seen plenty of extreme takes posted and boosted around here. I've been a part of many arguments where both I and my opponent cared more about winning than about truth.


@wolf480pl @vera I base my statement on my 4 years of being on my own instance. That’s another cool thing about mastodon, IMHO. You can shape your own experience in far better ways compared to centralised services.

@jwildeboer @vera yeah so fedi can be very different depending on who you hang out with...

so, how did you achieve it? How did you find those people who are willing to talk about serious stuff in nuanced way instead of posting cat pics?

@wolf480pl @vera First of all by being quite ignorant, I guess. I only engage when a thread/toot shows mexsomeone is really interested to discuss. And then I respect that by staying focused. Over time people notice that and somehow that has helped to keep my home Timeline diverse and interesting. Oh. And I almost never look at the federated timeline.

@wolf480pl @jwildeboer @vera On a similar note, how do I find the people who are willing to talk about serious stuff in a lighthearted way *and* post silly cat videos?

@zudlig @wolf480pl @jwildeboer well, the simplistic way I do it is like this:
1. Look on the federated tootline for any posts that interest you (e.g. pets and non-superficial stuff)
2. Go to that person's profile and take a look at their other posts, if it looks mostly good to you, then follow them

It's not a fast process to find ppl immediately but you can do it for a minute or 2 each time you log on, or less often if you prefer. Yes it's a bit hit or miss but that way my personalized feed tootline is more likely over time to reflect the topics/ppl I want.

@vera @jwildeboer

I've had 15 people vote in a 6h Delta vs Noctua poll without specifying what kinda fan I need.

And 18 people vote in a 24h poll about protocol extensibility which I think had enough information for people to make an informed decision.

I've seen, made, and voted in, silly polls and I think they're doing just as well as serious polls, if not better.

And outside of polls, it seems like more people care about the color of the bikeshed than the reactor control systems.

@jwildeboer Thanks, good observation of the detailed interactions and dynamics arising from this.I will keep an eye on this :)

@jwildeboer we also tend to naturally react to outrage a lot so it's not perfect, but at least human beings will get tired and want too look at other stuff eventually

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